Does Trump Get a Moral Mulligan?

We know the man we voted for.

President Donald Trump speaks to a gathering of mayors in the East Room of the White House in Washington, Wednesday, Jan. 24, 2018.

By Michael Brown Published on January 25, 2018

There’s been a firestorm of controversy after evangelical leader Tony Perkins said President Trump gets a “mulligan” for his past sexual indiscretions, as headline after headline reports on this apparently outrageous statement. To quote Perkins directly from his interview with Erin Burnett on CNN, “Yes, evangelicals, conservatives, they gave him a mulligan. They let him have a do-over. They said we’ll start afresh with you and we’ll give you a second chance.”

On the one hand, I can understand the outrage. We evangelicals didn’t give Bill Clinton a mulligan. We’re certainly not giving Harvey Weinstein a mulligan. And since we claim to be champions of marital fidelity and sexual purity, we could not have picked a worst poster boy for our cause — at least that is what we’re told.

As Michael Gerson wrote in The Washington Post, “The Trump evangelicals have lost their gag reflex.” Yes, we evangelicals have made our “political bargain with open eyes.”

Trump, Gerson argues,

has made profanity an unavoidable part of our political culture. He is in the midst of a gathering corruption scandal that has left close aides under indictment. He tells repeated and obvious lies. He incites ethnic and racial resentment as a political strategy and was caught on tape bragging about sexual assault. Add to this something that could never be said of Nixon: the credible accusation that Trump paid hush money to a porn star to cover up an affair.

And how does Franklin Graham respond to this?

We certainly don’t hold him up as the pastor of this nation and he is not. But I appreciate the fact that the president does have a concern for Christian values, he does have a concern to protect Christians whether it’s here at home or around the world, and I appreciate the fact that he protects religious liberty and freedom.

For Gerson and others, this is the height of hypocrisy. For them there is no excuse for the fact that, in his words, Trump evangelicals have become “sycophants, cheerleaders and enablers.”

From my perspective, to the extent we’ve minimized Trump’s past transgressions or turned him into a modern-day saint, there is some truth to these allegations. We’ve lost our moral compass.

But that is only one side of the story. And this is what many people find impossible to grasp: We voted for Donald Trump with our eyes wide open and without compromising our faith.

We Know Who We Voted For

If he did, in fact, have a fling with this porn star (which he denies) and pay to keep her quiet, we would not be surprised. And when he does use profanity (as many other presidents did before him), we are not surprised. And when he’s caught in a lie, we are not surprised. Grieved, yes. Surprised, no.

We don’t overlook his past transgressions. We don’t hail him as the exemplar of marital fidelity. And we don’t say to our constituents, “Follow Trump, as he follows Christ” (to echo Paul’s words in 1 Corinthians 11:1).

Rather, we say this: Babies are being slaughtered by Planned Parenthood, and this flawed man is willing to help us stop the slaughter. Christians are being massacred by ISIS, and this flawed man is willing to help stop the bloodshed. Our religious liberties are being threatened, and this flawed man is willing to take a stand on our behalf.

So, we appreciate him. We support him in carrying out his campaign promises. And as best as we can, behind closed doors and in other settings, we encourage him to step higher and to take the claims of Jesus seriously.

We appreciate Trump. We support him in carrying out his campaign promises. And as best as we can, we encourage him to step higher and to take the claims of Jesus seriously.

How is that hypocritical? How is that immoral? How is that compromised?

We weren’t impressed when he held up his family Bible during the campaign. And we weren’t surprised when he couldn’t quote a single verse from memory. We know the man we voted for.

And he knows who he is too, saying in his acceptance speech at the Republican National Convention,

At this moment, I would like to thank the evangelical community because, I will tell you what, the support they have given me — and I’m not sure I totally deserve it — has been so amazing. And has been such a big reason I’m here tonight. They have much to contribute to our policies.

A political insider even told me that during the campaign, when he asked Trump to take a strong stand on a marriage-related issue, he said, “I can’t do that, given my history.”

I can’t confirm this firsthand (although my source says he heard it for himself). But I can confirm that I’ve never heard Trump put himself forward as a paragon of marital virtue, which would make sense.

As for giving him a mulligan, that’s what you call the gospel. God forgives us, and we forgive others. Especially if they recognize their guilt and seek to make positive changes.

Why Not Grant Trump a Mulligan?

To this very moment, I feel confident that if Bill Clinton came forward and confessed to his past adulteries, taking full responsibility, seeking to make restitution, and asking for forgiveness, we would line up to be the first to forgive publicly. And should he then say, “I’ve had a change of heart regarding abortion,” we would welcome him as a colleague on the front lines of the pro-life movement.

In certain ways, Trump has presented more of a mixed bag. He continues to engage in unchristian behavior while the same time making a clear break with his past. Yet he has consistently welcomed evangelical Christians into his life. He has listened attentively when they have spoken to him. And to my knowledge, he has never rebuffed their calls for him to change.

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So, while he remains a work in progress, he continues to champion many important causes. And with all his blemishes, he is our president.

Do we not, then, grant him a mulligan when it comes to his past? And if we were to learn that he committed adultery 50 times in his former life, would this change our view of him today?

To repeat: We voted for him with our eyes wide open (at least, most of us did). And we can support him, with the necessary caveats, without denying or compromising our faith.

What’s so scandalous about that?

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  • Putin on the Ritz

    The leader of the free (cough) world cannot be a saint; he has to have blood on his hands.

  • SophieA

    Who among us is perfect? What would Jesus say? Maybe one should read the account of the woman caught in adultery and the ensuing thwarted stoning incident. Or maybe one should read the account of the woman at the well. I think Jesus came to those of us who needed a Savior. Or maybe there are those who think they have the “moral high ground” (whatever THIS means) to cast that first stone. Maybe we should follow the Word of God instead of “virtue signaling” faux outrage.

    • Andy6M

      Extending grace and mercy does not mean that he deserves to sit in the White House. Yes, everyone sins, but the Lord does call us to demonstrate good character, and there are ramifications for not doing so. I certainly do believe that Jesus has room for Trump, but it is also within the Scriptural and Christian ethos to reasonably say that his failures have disqualified him from leadership. Within that same ethos there is also room for an amount of shame for those who claim the cause of Christ yet seem so willing to gloss over such character failure to the point of defending the man at all costs and declaring him God’s man and as such righteous and beyond reproach.

      • Putin on the Ritz

        Who deserves to sit in the White House?

        Who decides this?

        • Andy6M

          I don’t know. I would ask, “who deserves consideration?”

      • SophieA

        I’m not defending Mr Trump—not at all. You, sir, are ascribing errant intent by my words for purposes known to you only. You are entitled to think what you like as you cast your stone.

        • Andy6M

          I apologize SophieA for my errant ascribing. Can I ask in what way I’m casting a stone?

      • Paul

        “Extending grace and mercy does not mean that he deserves to sit in the White House.”

        Of course not, he occupies the White House because he won the election.

        • Andy6M

          Yes, he won the election. I’m concerned with whether or not he was deserving of evangelical Christian support, and I’m asking if the whitewash of his character by so some of my evangelical brethren is a good witness before the world in which we live.

          • Paul

            It was easy to vote for Trump in the general election, just had to look at the alternative.

          • Andy6M

            Sure – Clinton was a mess and I would never have voted for her. But certainly there were people with better character than Trump that could have claimed the Republican nomination. I’m not interested in naming who, my only concern here is to say that I think character is important – maybe important enough to split the vote and lose the election. If I believe God is sovereign (which I do), then I should trust him with things while I cast a vote for economic, social, etc concerns, AND character (which I believe he values). Perhaps if we bit the bullet and suffered a loss by splitting the vote in favor of a third candidate with character, our leaders would take notice and smarten up, and the world around us would recognize that we practice what we preach. And yeah, a Clinton presidency would have been a disaster.

          • Paul

            For me it isn’t relevant to drag the primary battle into the general election. It hasn’t been since Bush 1 that my primary selection made it to the general election, so what.

            I hear people talk about skipping an election because they don’t like either candidate. I think that’s the chicken approach and spits on the graves of everyone who has died so that I can cast a ballot. The options often suck but that’s not going to stop me from voting or throw away my vote on some down ballot option that will never make it just to appease someone who wants to condemn me for choosing someone who they don’t like.

            I sleep fine after voting for Trump, he’s not my pastor, he’s a politician. I don’t whitewash his past, but neither do I keep dwelling on it like some insist on.

          • Elizabeth Litts

            Who are you to say who ‘diserves’ any thing??? Have you all the sudden gotten so arrogant that you can tell God who to extend mercy to and who not too?? He saves all who call on his name. and are you so arrogant that you can tell God who to put in leadership??? There was a guy named Peter–who denied Jesus -and he was chosen to be a leader, I seem to recall somebody named Paul-who killed and jailed Christians-and he was put in leadership. Are you God that you know Mr. Trumps heart??

          • Andy6M

            Elizabeth Litts – I have not said anything about who God should or should not extend mercy to. That’s not my contention at all. My contention is that a person’s character, demonstrated over time, has an impact on how I vote. I firmly believe that a good mark of a person’s character is how he deals with his mistakes. Peter is a great example of humility in the face of failure. I am left with less to work with when it comes to Trump. I believe that if he has repented and accepted Christ, then he is forgiven. But forgiven does not automatically mean fit to lead.

            But beyond that, my concern is for how members of the evangelical church (of which I am happily and proudly a part) have been so quick to sweep under the rug his issues of character for the sake of political gain. I am quite happy that Clinton is not in the White House, but that does not mean that I think Trump is a good choice that does the name of Christ good service. God may have put him there, but I would view that more along the lines of God putting the Babylonians, Assyrians, Persians and Romans over Israel. Or perhaps Ahab. So sure – in that context I guess he deserves to be there.

    • Stuart Dauermann

      These are not the issues. The issues under discussion is the disgraceful refusal of Right Wing Evangelical leaders like Perkins and Graham to take a prophetic stance in their spiritual leadership. They refuse to confront the current President with his sins. Should John the Baptist have kept his mouth shut about Herod’s having his brother’s wife as his own? Were the prophets of the OT all in error for confronting their leaders with their sins, even while supporting their kingship in principle? And is not the name of God blasphemed among the Gentiles because people like Franklin Graham are instead stumbling over themselves making excuses for sins that even pagans recognize as such?

      • Andy6M

        Agreed!

  • Xrucianus

    How is our stance hypocritical, immoral, compromised?

    WHAT IS THE THEOLOGY OF A MULLIGAN?? Where do we find any cross-bearing follower of Christ, giving a hedonistic authority a PASS on their sin, for some “supposed” Kingdom gain?? The very assertion is not only compromised, immoral and hypocritical to the integrity of theology it’s just plain foolishness! Perkins and other evangelical leaders have heard no confession, no admission, no humility or repentance, and nothing that resembles a statement of love for the forgiveness of sins. And yet they’re (near daily) giving Trump – a man who was a frequent guest at Hugh Hefner’s mansion, appeared on pornogrphy mags, has bragged about his sexual conquests, on his third marriage, 19 women are ready to testify of his sexual harassment and one notorious porn actress claims to have had an affair with him – and we evangelicals (who rightfully called Clinton on his many affairs; who spuriously made accusations re Obama and gay partners, Carla Brunisholz, Beyoncé, etc.) – we evangelicals are well & good with extending a “MULLIGAN” to this president simply because he can champion Israel, restrict abortion & protect Christianity? This is not only pure, blatant hypocrisy, it’s theological drivel! WHERE IN THE SCRIPTURES DOES GOD OVERLOOK OUR SIN FOR POLITICAL ADVANTAGE? We’re talking about demeaning the value of His Son’s blood in the cross! In the eyes of an increasingly sin-bound culture, that’s exactly what they see & hear – evangelicals not taking their core message about redemption seriously – all for political gain. That kind of transaction is nothing less than “detestable” in the eyes of a holy God… In that state, we are much more in need of doing Joel 2:12-17 than we are in scoring political points for ourselves.

    My concern is who evangelicals are showing ourselves to be, and how we are trading in the integrity of our vital & primary mandate: THE DECLARATION THAT JESUS CHRIST CAME INTO THE WORLD TO SAVE SINNERS for 4 years of political victory achieved through the means of one who many of you have already described as “not a priest”; “a bombastic man”, and “a wrecking ball” etc. – and our cultural adversaries see all the more as anti-Spirit of Christ…? WHAT WILL IT TAKE FOR 82% OF US EVANGELICALS TO WAKE UP TO THE FACT THAT OUR PARTISAN CHAMPIONING OF TRUMP IS DOING DECADES OF DAMAGE TO THE INTEGRITY OF OUR WITNESS TO THE CHARACTER & WAYS OF CHRIST?
    WHAT POLITICAL GAIN IS WORTH THE LOSS OF THAT INTEGRITY? And if we’re WILLING to make that kind of exchange (the very thought gives me chills), what does that tell us about the condition of evangelicalism in America in 2018??

    Finally: Why is it that when evangelical leaders point out the very obvious, out of his own mouth, problems of this president, so many of us rush to his defense with crazy arguments we’d have never stopped assailing if they were launched in defense of Bill, Barak or Hillary? The hypocrisy and lack of integrity in our defense of president Trump is doing catastrophic damage to our witness to our watching culture. Try talking to someone under the age of 40 about the truth of the gospel; the exclusive claims of Christ – Trump & evangelicals comes up every time. And the silly position we’ve taken about him automatically turns off their mind, and then their heart, to their need to be saved by the (other) Savior we’re championing – the One our nation desperately needs

    • Samantha Stolz

      Amen

    • Tom Stolz

      Excellent reply. Thank you.

    • Matthew Morris

      Best comment reply of all time.

  • Julio Severo

    Wonderful piece, Mike. But I have a question. You said, “I feel confident that if Bill Clinton came forward and confessed to his past adulteries, taking full responsibility, seeking to make restitution, and asking for forgiveness, we would line up to be the first to forgive publicly.” Trump never did it. What about now?

    • Matthew Morris

      Least repentant mulligan recipient ever

    • Stuart Dauermann

      And I think Dr Brown is overly optimistic. To the bone hatred for the Clintons enwrapped in all kinds of conspiratorialism is widespread on the Religious Right. Need I list all the rumors?

  • Mr. M

    But a man in a committed, loving relationship with another man? Straight to hell. Do not pass go. Do not collect $200.

    • Karen

      Heck, a man committed to a wife who isn’t a silent stupid doormat is a dealbreaker for these guys.

    • Vince

      No such thing.

      • Mr. M

        Yes there is. Your hatred of gay people doesn’t will them out of existence.

  • Karen

    The only thing you care about is banning abortion. Trump could do absolutley anything, including pay for illegal abortions, but if he makes the right noises about overturning Roe you all are okay with it. The fact that he shares your opinion that women belong barefoot and pregnant and confined to the house is just that much lf a sweetener to you. You are all filthy hypocrites.

    • The General

      Here’s a list of all the Christians who value your opinion:

      1.

      • Concerned Christian

        may that 2, i value her opinion.

        • The General

          Sock puppets don’t count, missy.

          The number stands at 0.

          • Concerned Christian

            ouch! 🙂

  • Concerned Christian

    what’s funny about this logic is that any church that ever refused money from dug dealers, mobsters, lottery players, etc., was apparently very ignorant. They should have just accepted the money.

    Conservative Christians have made it plainly clear that:

    “the ends ALWAYS justifies the means!”

    Machiavelli would truly be proud of today’s Christian Conservatives!

    • Hmmm…

      I would love to hear your testimony, of how you came to Jesus. Please share.

      • Concerned Christian

        To be honest, I don’t think it’s relevant. Origin stories are basically used to justify oneself or for others to disqualify you. If for instance this were a general discussion, how I became a Christian might be relevant.

        However, within the context of our prior conversations, I will simply say that I am a Christian. If you disagree because of things that I’ve said then I’m fine with that. I’m comfortable with who I am and Whose I am.

        We live in a world where fear is making people demand purity. If I don’t like the news it’s fake. If you’re not conservative enough, then you’re a RINO. If you say things that disagree with my religious belief than you’re fake.

        If you tell me you’re a Christian, I believe you. If you’re committing a sin, that you don’t think is sin, then I would minister to you and encourage you to continue to develop your relationship with God. If you have a desire to grow, then the sin will take care of itself.

        Your beliefs, alone, will certainly not cause me to question your faith. I may question your relationship but never your faith.

        Even with my kids, I don’t discuss what I did or didn’t do when I was their age. I want them to know that their life is not my life. Their relationship with God is their relationship not mine. I want them confident that they can trust God and trust themselves!

        If you’re always trying to prove things to others, it simply a indicator that you don’t trust God and thus your own decision making.

        • Hmmm…

          It was a very simple request …

          • Concerned Christian

            understood. so my response is it’s not relevant for our discussion.

          • Hmmm…

            Are you ashamed of being a Christian? If not one, why do you assume the “moniker?” Do you just use it to maybe get real Christians to absorb your dissidence on their blogs? And, since that hasn’t worked out at all, why keep it up?

          • Concerned Christian

            this is my point. You simply can’t accept that I am a Christian. If i said I’ve been a Christian my whole life, would it matter? If I lived the life that Trump has lived and now I’m a Christian would it matter?

            if you have a question about what I believe and what scriptures I base my beliefs on, please ask away. I will be more than happy to answer you.

          • Hmmm…

            You just cannot play it straight, can you? Are you allergic to the truth, facts? Do you break out in hives if you can’t convolute any issue, especially about your prejudice against Trump? So, maybe you had an immoral life and came to the Lord? That is a huge victory, nothing to be ashamed of. You have your own sensitivities about such things, so why are you so hard on Mr. Trump? Don’t you realize what you sow, you reap? What goes around, comes around. Yeah, I think you should go work on your sin list from LInda, or ask her for it to help you be a bit more humble about yourself and not so damning of others.

          • Concerned Christian

            I’m not sure what I would be ashamed of?

            However, I don’t believe you’re playing it straight. What do you want to know about my beliefs? It seems like you have a question but you want to have a context to ask it in. Just ask it?

          • Chip Crawford

            I did have the same question asked before, a very simple one, to which you gave a long, elaborate reason not to answer. How did you come to the Lord? Like, did a peer witness to you, a family member, decision in youth group or church?

          • Concerned Christian

            I will answer if you can tell me why you want to know?

          • Chip Crawford

            Why not? It was a relative with me, one greatly altered, very touching. It was wonderful. I am very happy about it myself.

          • Hmmm…

            You shouldn’t be ashamed of coming to the Lord or of the past life before. He can wash and forgive it all as you lay it before him. I was clear about wanting to hear your testimony. You are calling yourself a Christian here, but you side with the world rather than God and his word with the relentless criticism and condemnation. The positions you take and the attitudes you allow yourself indicate a heart not linked with God and his word.

  • Stuart Dauermann

    What is scandalous in my experience is Right Wing Christians unprepared to tolerate any criticism of Trump, and doing so in the name of God; what is scandalous is his attempt to neutralize and stigmatize the Press calling all unwelcome news about himself “Fake News;” what is scandalous is his refusal to speak clearly against white power positions and partisans; what is scandalous is his rferring to black africa, haiti, and El Salvador as shithole natioins from which we do not want immigrants, but rather people from Norway; what is scandalous is his canny polarization of this country; what is scandalous is evangelical ethics up for sale if the politics are right. Other than that? Nothing much.

    • Paul

      Would you rather have Hillary?

      • Stuart Dauermann

        That is an irrelevant question and a diversion. We are talking about the person we have, not the person we don’t have.

        • Paul

          We’re talking about judging people for casting a vote in an election where we were going to elect either Hillary or Donald. It’s absolutely relevant to compare the two.

          • Stuart Dauermann

            There were many other conservative candidates around whom Republicans could have unified. Whose responsibility is it that they failed to do so? And what does this have to do NOW with the fact that Right Wing evangelicals like Franklin-son-of-Billy-Graham are unable to make sound moral judgments about the current President? It is disgraceful pandering.

          • Paul

            There is a difference between the primaries and the general election. I voted for Cruz in the primaries but he lost. A lot of Christians I know supported Cruz, but he lost. Move on to the general election and we’re now talking Hillary vs Donald.

          • Stuart Dauermann

            It remains an irrelevant question. The issue under discussion is the disgraceful refusal of Right Wing Evangelical leaders like Perkins and Graham to take a prophetic stance in their spiritual leadership. They refuse to confront the current President with his sins. Should John the Baptist have kept his mouth shut about Herod’s having his brother’s wife as his own? Were the prophets of the OT all in error for confronting their leaders with their sins, even while supporting their kingship in principle? And is not the name of God blasphemed among the Gentiles because people like Franklin Graham are instead stumbling over themselves making excuses for sins that even pagans recognize as such?

          • Paul

            No, this isn’t about a few people, it’s a projection and attempted condemnation of all Christians who voted for Trump and today support some of his positions. I’m not in denial he has a checkered past, some of it is pretty bad IMO. But sadly that was the better option in the general election. It is what it is, I’m glad crooked Hillary didn’t win, and as it turns out there’s been plenty of positives from the Trump administration. Gorsuch, tax law, Jerusalem, pipelines, booming economy, to name a few. We all get it, you don’t like Trump, there’s stuff I don’t like either. But he won, get over it already and make the most of it.

          • Andy6M

            That’s a good point Paul. We’re not so far apart I think. I do understand that many people didn’t necessarily vote for Trump as much as they voted against Clinton. I get it. I guess what I’ve been saying is that there does seem to be a sizeable group of people, who would call themselves Evangelical Christians, that are prepared to whitewash and overlook Trump’s checkered past (and his checkered present), even going so far as coming off as defending him no matter what. That I find troubling. I do believe character is important, and I know that no one’s character is perfect – it saddens me to think that neither side could pick better than they candidates that they did.

          • Paul

            Romans 13:1 is really hard to process in this regards, I know it was especially so for me during the prior administration:

            “Every person is to be in subjection to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God.”

            As such Trump as POTUS is established by God. We’re all broken vessels, the insistence that Trump should be less broken sounds nice but God knows him warts and all and can and has used him. It’s a mystery but it is what it is.

          • Hmmm…

            A point could also be made that there is much hidden to come out that will reveal far deeper faults and shortcomings than those blazoned out about Trump. Like there are some white washed tombs around about to have their rotten cores exposed. And when that really happens, all the media hype will only embarrass and expose them further for their complicity.

          • Paul

            I have no doubt that there is such deep corruption that has been going on (think email servers and the fake ‘investigation’ for starters), whether it will be fully exposed is another question. I can hope.

          • Chip Crawford

            If you charge Mr. Trump of current and ongoing adultery and/or predatory behavior that is trending, please cite time, place and be prepared for further questioning. Until then, your ignorance of God’s forgiveness of those who have turned from such is your problem. The answer is that Mr. Trump has turned, is ashamed of that past, and Messrs. Perkins and Graham, et al are in lockstep with the Father in Heaven rather than the devil on earth in that regard. To you, sir: Repent and believe the Gospel, which is good news that God would forgive a hypocritical sinner like you who himself offends deeply in harsh and critical heart attitudes, in the damnable Pharisee fashion — the only sinners that Jesus warned severely.

          • Concerned Christian

            you can’t seriously believe this?

          • Chip Crawford

            Provide your data accuser, of Mr. Trump’s current adulterous trysts.

          • Concerned Christian

            “The answer is that Mr. Trump has turned, is ashamed of that past”

          • Chip Crawford

            Great. God forgives. One’s sins are moved as far as the east is from the west with repentance. That’s good news for you, Fake Christian, he will forgive your hypocritical judging of others as well. I’m just saying to you what Jesus said to the Pharisees, whom you are emulating if you hold anyone’s repented past against them.

          • Concerned Christian

            yes God forgives but has Trump ask for it?

            Cal Thomas
            ===============
            “You have said you never felt the need to ask for God’s forgiveness, and yet repentance for one’s sins is a precondition to salvation. I ask you the question Jesus asked of Peter: Who do you say He is?”

            Trump:
            =========
            “I will be asking for forgiveness, but hopefully I won’t have to be asking for much forgiveness.”

            So he says “I will be asking”, implying that he has not asked. So again I ask, do you seriously believe Trump is sorry for anything that he hasn’t been able to lie his way out of?

            I know it feels good to rationalize that I’m only asking these questions because “I’m a Fake Christian”, however, even an atheist can see trump for what he really is. It’s only evangelicals that can’t.

          • Chip Crawford

            God sees it in entirely more detail than you, all the sins and short comings, but the heart that’s before him is also not wholly visible to you. I seem to recall his stating all of that was his province. You must have lost 50 pounds at least since Trump came along, sweating all these bad Christians being suckered into supporting him. My, my … how tiring it all must be ….

          • Concerned Christian

            unfortunately the holidays killed my weight loss.

            that being said, Trump hasn’t suckered any Christians. Everyone has a choice to make.

            I look at Andrew Cuomo from NY, he lives with his girl friend. If he runs for president will evangelicals object? We could have the first president with a live in girlfriend all because of the behavior accepted from Trump.

            In the future this will apply to anyone running for office. Trump, with the help of conservative Christians, has set the standard by which all future office holders will be judged.

          • Chip Crawford

            No, I don’t think so. Oh, have you gotten your sin list yet from Linda? Maybe you are busy working away on them, so I won’t keep you ….

          • Concerned Christian

            well evangelicals condemn pro-choice, members of the LGBT community, planed parenthood, and democrats.

            My argument is about the behavior of one individual that happens to have more power than all of the above combined and far less character and integrity.

            My biggest beef with him is not that he is a sinner. A sinner can be a good and effective leader. My biggest beef is that he is a horrible human being. Would you really want to be in the presence of this person? Not only that but he’s ignorant about basic facts of government, takes credit for anything good and never takes blame for anything bad. Has loyalty to NO one but himself.

            But somehow has groups that have preached character and integrity my whole life suddenly turn around and condemn those who live by those principals in order to sanction someone that absolutely could care less about them.

            No I don’t need a sin list from Linda.

          • Chip Crawford

            that’s a matter of opinion, and since you exalt opinion far above truth and facts, my opinion is that you are all wet on your rubbish above, below and all around. I think you are a mess yourself, confused and confusing, all over the board, and from what I’ve read around this post, you may even need to get saved. That would explain a lot of your confusion. I hope you take care of that as soon as possible. And, if you are, I hope you stop being ashamed of it. Do you want Jesus to be ashamed of you?

          • Concerned Christian

            again I will say:

            “But somehow has groups that have preached character and integrity my whole life suddenly turn around and condemn those who live by those principals in order to sanction someone that absolutely could care less about them.”

            whatever I might be, it wouldn’t be a problem if I agreed with you.

          • Chip Crawford

            Yadda Yadda;sounds like a sock puppet, lol
            P.S. If you said that before, I thankfully missed it. It still doesn’t make any sense. Sorry

          • Concerned Christian

            well, i must be doing something good, yet another insulting name.

            Just like trump, when in doubt insult! 🙂

            clearly trump is not learning anything from the Christians around him but Christians are learning a lot from him.

            however, I would suggest that like trump you stick to one.

            “Fake Christian” is probably the best one. I can see the power in people like you doing God’s job for Him. I mean “God” not trump “god”.

            “sock puppet”, I’m not really sure what that means.

          • Chip Crawford

            Well, bless your heart. Don’t be discouraged.

          • Concerned Christian

            oh never. i think you guys are funny.

          • Chip Crawford

            Hope you catch on one of these days

          • Concerned Christian

            no, i get the picture. I just need to agree with what you believe and then I’ll no longer be a fake Christian or a “sock puppet”.

            much like trump, there is no room for disagreement!

          • Concerned Christian

            that is truly not surprising.

          • Chip Crawford

            No, I imagine you often draw that response.

          • Linda

            Not referring to old sins. It’s the current sins that make a mockery of the Christians who support him – excessive pride, outrageous boasting, calling people nasty and hurtful names, making insulting comments of a personal nature about people of all kinds, gossip such as tv host Mika was bleeding from a facelift, playing favorites and stirring up strife, gluttony as evidenced by obesity, arrogance….

          • Concerned Christian

            where’s your proof. the only place we see facts like this is obviously fake news. Of course that describes all news outlets that say something negative about trump.

            however, it doesn’t matter. if you don’t have facts, that i will never accept, to backup your shameless truth telling, you should be quiet! 🙂

          • Chip Crawford

            LOL; that is pretty funny … but your insistence on your own jaded view wears thin. Go on back to the slander hawks and get some new talking points. The Lord just loves his children to wallow around in such (NOT!).

          • Concerned Christian

            🙂

          • Hmmm…

            If you want to live in a place where you blab anything you think and insist on it being true, move to the Philippines or some banana republic. You’d be right at home. It’s not facts that anyone would accept, it’s facts that have backing. Your mocking that shows how shameful is your lax practice, but you do have very bad examples in the media and your Dem leaders. Obstruct by saying any slur or slander that comes to mind. The Shame is on your, sir. What you appear to be ashamed of is relating your testimony. I’d say that is patent confusion. We’re supposed to swallow down all this stuff we see through. No sale,

          • Concerned Christian

            “blab anything you think and insist on it being true”

            are you honestly saying that this doesn’t apply to Trump?

            “Philippines or some banana republic”

            You do know that trump has shown admiration for Rodrigo Duterte, as well as other strong men in Turkey and Russia?

            However, I am curios, what news sources do you find to be reputable?

            from what i can tell, evangelicals don’t trust:

            ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, MSNBC, Washington Post, NY Times, Wall Street Journal, democrats, etc.

            I have no idea who or what conservative Christians find acceptable?

            let’s find a source that you find acceptable?

          • Hmmm…

            Why does the Bible not govern your speech and behavior?
            You are flying under the flag of “Concerned Christian” here with very unChristian disrespect and slanderous accusations toward the leader of our country and real Christians who do follow the admonitions of scripture not to do that

          • Concerned Christian

            it does. maybe not to the degree that you find acceptable but the Bible does govern my life.

            So if a person is a liar, is it disrespectful or slanderous to call them a liar? if you’re saying that trump is not a serial liar, then i will respectfully disagree.

            Was John the Baptist wrong for calling out the behavior of Herod?

            Also, I’ve been around long enough to remember how those real Christians treated both Bill Clinton & Obama.

            but i would love to know what slanderous accusation I’ve made and where you get your source that I’m wrong?

          • Hmmm…

            So, you don’t really know the Lord, never committed your life to him? Evident all along. Yet you figure to pass your judgmental, worldly and non-biblical attitudes and positions as another “Christian” viewpoint. No one has bought. I hope you get saved. But the liberal spin is repugnant here, so stop whining about our honest reaction to your charade. #FalseFlag

          • Concerned Christian

            there you go, discredit anyone that says things that you disagree with. I tell you I’m a Christian and you can’t take it at face value because I disagree with you.

            If I agreed with you, i could be an atheist and you wouldn’t care.

            Is Micheal Gerson a Christian? He’s the one that wrote the article that Brown responded to. Is he discredited as well?

            Btw, I’m not judging trump as a liar, I’m stating a well known fact that he is a liar.

          • Hmmm…

            Real Christians are disciples and follow the teachings of the Bible, not the MSM’s heathen trash. But you are definitely not God, so stop judging in his place and get to your own obvious short comings. You claim to have children and a wife, but you spend most of your time here and obviously in front of the boob tube getting stoked on hype. Take care of your family. Do some honest work. Leave sincere people alone. Beat it, bum.

          • Concerned Christian

            So I fail your purity test. I understand that since I don’t live up to your standards of being a Christian, i must not be one. Nor can I possibly be a good husband, father, or productive human being.

            Luckily, I do not try to prove to anyone that I meet their purity standards. Nor do I try to manipulate others to meet mine. Further, I don’t try to:

            prove to Christians that I am a Christian
            prove to blacks that I’m really black
            prove to democrats that I’m a democrat
            prove to republicans that I’m a republican
            prove to whites that I’m not a lazy, thuggish, or ignorant black man
            prove to anyone that i love america

            prove to sinners that Jesus is the only way. I share what the Bible says and what God has done for and through me. My goal is to at a minimum plant the seed. I don’t have to prove because as they get to know Him better, He will prove it!

            I am comfortable with my relationship with God and that I am working towards being the person that He wants me to be. That is the only purity standard that I’m concerned with.

            I have shared my opinions with you and you have shared yours with me. I disagree with your opinions but I would never question your faith.

            One last point, Trump is doing a lot more to hurt “sincere people” like you than I ever could!

          • Hmmm…

            Stop stalking me. I said BEAT IT ! I’ll report you if you continue to do this.

          • Concerned Christian

            feel free to do so! 🙂

          • Chip Crawford

            Linda, dear, please feel free to judge and run sin lists on anyone you choose. Such absorption after all has full support of scripture (satirical). I’d like to see one on you. I could add some that I thought missing and you, of course, would no doubt like to do the same for me. You all do exactly what you say Christians do, on the other side. Instead of rehearsing the gains and help to the nation, you prefer a sin list and being sour if anyone doesn’t use their sin pointer like you do. Every party has a pooper and all of that …BTW, are you aware that sins of the heart are considered entirely more serious. A case could be made that you are so involved your own self-righteous self. But God bless and keep you from rotting all the way through is my humble prayer …

          • Paul

            Gluttony because he could lose 20 lbs? Good grief. That kind of attack simply destroys your credibility.

          • Chip Crawford

            Say, Paul, oh fellow, did you happen to notice that sin lists are quite the thing now. Have you received yours yet?

          • Paul

            Yes, I’ve been called some interesting things here in Stream comments, it doesn’t bother me.

          • Hmmm…

            Did this compilation come from your time with the Lord?

          • Paul (not that one)

            What’s your evidence that Trump has turned and is ashamed of his past? What’s your evidence of the fruit of Christ in his life. Please give Biblical references to show that the preachers listed above are in lockstep with the Father in Heaven. Also, doesn’t the Bible say that if you believe in your hear and confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord you are saved. If Mr Dauermann has done that, yet doesn’t like, endorse, or vote for Trump, where is the verse that says he is not saved? When does an affinity for Trump become a salvation issue? I think that you may need to spend less time on forums and more time studying the Gospel sir!

          • Chip Crawford

            You are astonishing, Mr. not the good Paul. The bombast alone makes one hoot with laughter, it is so outrageous. Hey, it’s your loss of cool that’s making you play the fool. Now calm down or get out of town.

          • Concerned Christian

            by that logic it sounds like the devil gave you a choice between the devil and the devil and you chose the devil. not only that, you refuse to hold the devil you got accountable.

            so by your own logic, the devil won!

          • Paul

            A flawed analysis from the fake Christian.

          • Concerned Christian

            yes, finally something we can agree on!

          • Paul

            I’m surprised you’re admiting you’re a fake Christian, that’s progress.

          • Paul (not that one)

            If you were a genuine Christian, wouldn’t you want to show him the love of Christ and truth of the Gospel? Do you witness to friends and co-workers in the same spirit that you interact on this board? If so, please stop, you’re harming the testimony of Christ.

          • Paul

            ‘concerned christian’ and I have had plenty of debate that has illuminated my perspective.

          • Hmmm…

            On that subject, CC, I renew my request from below, that you share your testimony with us of how you came to Jesus. Thanks so much.

        • Vince

          He won. You lost.
          Try to act like a man instead of baby.

    • Chip Crawford

      How is it that you are not aware of the widespread outrage fatigue from the automatic offense taking and related propaganda shills. What credibility existed for those continually proffering such has seriously dissipated. One wonders at the diminished capacity of thought you and yours demonstrate by actually accelerating the seamy tactics that have so repulsed the electorate in recent history.

      • Paul (not that one)

        You might want to try actually answering the man, and his concerns rather than dismissing them. Have you ever thought that maybe the way you interact on message boards, and potentially in person (although hopefully you are more graceful and restrained) is part of the reason your country is so divided? Maybe if tried listening to and understanding one another it would give space for people to get reasonable points across, learn and grow.

        • Chip Crawford

          You might find out what you are trying to talk about, Mr. Not the Nice Paul. I don’t suffer foolishness … will put it that way. That includes you or anyone else who blows in and starts jerking everyone around, airing their ignorance in an assumed supervisory role. You are doing what you decry. The scripture tells us that’s how judges and critics operate. Advice for you: How about outgrowing these things and coming on up to some edification. You have no history in these discussions and don’t know what you are talking about. God bless you all the same, and especially.

          • Paul (not that one)

            It’s interesting that you call me names like your god, mr Trump. As I have a busy and exciting life outside of article forums, this will be my last post. Especially to you. It’s interesting that you call for edification without giving any. As you clearly are in a state of cognitive dissonance when it comes to matters of history, politics, and theology, I’ll pass on some advice on matter for which is very important to you. Yourself. I’ve looked over your responses to me and comments to others on this forum, and like your hero mr trump, you sir are a bully. I pray that you will hear these words and change your ways, although hopefully your bullying is only exercised online and not in the real world. I hope you encounter God’s love and learn to treat people with grace. If you feel this is harsh, it is only because of your claims to follow and serve God, do I call you to a higher standard and to repentance. God bless

          • Chip Crawford

            No, I’ve learned how to handle a bully, and you don’t like it. A more thoroughly obnoxious blast onto a post, judging and calling out everyone in sight, is to your discredit. Oh do please, don’t go away mad, but yes, do go away. No one needs that. It will not be tolerated from you no matter how much you insist upon holding the floor with abusive and overbearing blasts. Jesus would not have lain down under such interference and we are not rugs here either.

  • Chip Crawford

    No, he does not, to answer the title question. But his particularly immoral offenses (sexual matters) are in the past and not current. Those screaming for blood because of his immorality of the past clearly do not comprehend when one turns from such, there is forgiveness from God. If they did, they’d know how much trouble they are in themselves for their black-hearted hatred and condemnation. THAT is more unGodly than the immoral acts they cite. Yes, they occurred; but they are not now. Repent means change, by the way, for the obvious and ignorant heathens offering their ungodly opinions. Mr. Trump knows and follows God more than ever, not in the spiritual way that the mature, seasoned and separated Mike Pence does, but he’s not where he used to be. There is no question his act needs a lot of work. There’s no canonization going forward when Christians act like Christians instead of like heathens about it. Wake up and tend to your own weed patch, judgers and haters. God uses flawed vessels; that’s the only kind he has, actually.

  • The Lost Fart

    Precisely! As Americans we have a moral obligation to vote in favor of our values. But sadly, Jesus and Satan never appear on the ballot. Last year we were left to pick between a schmuck (who at least pretended to support many causes we consider vital) and someone who rode into the Democratic National Convention hall on a red dragon. So far the schmuck has disappointed me less than I expected him to.

  • Jeremy L

    So, you essentially admit that you don’t care what Trump does so long as he fulfills your demands. And you convince yourself this is not hypocritical because Trump has “changed” and “cares” about what you stand for. Well, number one, he hasn’t “repented” of anything, not in the least. He’s just as immoral now as ever and only regrets flings with porn stars etc. when they hamper his image. And number two, he truly doesn’t care about your causes, but is rather pandering to you. Why not just admit hypocrisy? That you don’t care about morality, really, but just have a bone to pick with people you deem “sinners” and know Trump can squash said people

    • Chip Crawford

      Why don’t you just wipe the froth off your mouth, throw some cold water in your face, towel dry it off, get a relaxing not depressing beverage, sit back in your chair and calm yourself down. Your hate rage got your blood pressure up, so stop reading these pages if they so incite you to lose control. You need to be told what to do because you are out of rational range. Now, heads up: The devil is glad of your help, but he pays very, very poorly. While you still have control of your will this side of eternity, you might stop lending yourself to his use. I will be praying you make the right choice. I will be ignoring if you do not.

      • Jeremy L

        I’m not in league with the devil, I’m stating facts. Brown, however, wouldn’t miss a chance to support the devil if the devil were Republican and wasn’t Hillary and promised to end gay marriage and abortion. The whole “being the devil” thing wouldn’t matter.

        • Chip Crawford

          Prove your “facts” – dates, times, corroborating witnesses to those and more. You can’t even copy text right in front of you accurately. I said nothing about “being the devil” or “in league with the devil.” I said used of the devil and that’s a sucker deal you get drawn into unwittingly when you get over in his territory. That’s accusing, hating, judging and the like. Ignorance of how these things work is no excusing them. You have a conscience. You know better than to give bent to your lower nature – anger, malice, hatred. That puts you right on the devil’s territory and when you give voice to that – you have just been used. Now prove your “facts,” otherwise unproven by expert investigation. If you can’t, don’t expect the good people here to absorb your ignorant slander of them and rumor mongering you are foolish enough to swallow and pass along without proper substantiation.

          • Jeremy L

            LOL at “good people”. You want to talk about “accusing, hating, judging” and “anger, malice, and hatred”? Take a look at Evangelicals and the “sinners” they love going after! And way to miss my point. The point is Evangelicals would vote for the devil if the devil promised to give them what they wanted. Because they claim to be moral examples for everyone else, that makes them hypocrites. Trump’s immorality and lack of remorse for virtually everything and anything he’s said or done is abundantly clear. No “experts” are needed to show that Donald Trump is a bad man and a liar who is playing his supporters for saps.

          • Chip Crawford

            God bless you.

  • Rob Abney

    The Washington Post accusations are not substantiated, they are democrat talking points, each one can be and has been disputed. Furthermore, they do not represent areas where most citizens have the authority to pass judgement. As a citizen our only authority over the president is our vote, and our vote considers many things in addition to his public religious behavior. Christians do not have to give Trump a “mulligan”, they should not feel scandalized for supporting the man who supports Christian positions as well as any president ever have, so far.

  • tz1

    We gave Bush a mulligan on invading Iraq, destroying the Christian community there, the drone wars killing many innocents, Switching to the child-rapist narco-terrorist Northern Alliance to nation build Afghanistan instead of getting Bin Laden for terrorism (why not let him go? That isn’t the point!), and torturing people, many to death to try to get them to confess to anything. Oh, and he and his bumbling brother Jeb! (please clap) dithered and signaled, and Terri Schiavo DIED HORRIBLY AS WE ALL WATCHED! I’d add inaction on abortion and his appointment of Roberts that gave us Federally enforced Gay Marriage.

    Also note Billy Bush was involved in the P*y Grab Access Hollywood tape.

    The entire Bush Dynasty is corrupt and is likely to and should burn in the most painful part of Hell for all eternity if anyone had any standards or sense of proportion.

    But where were/are the Evangelicals on the Bush family?

    Oh, they gave them again and again a Mulligan.

    First remove the plank and condem these horrible, evil, monsters whose last name is Bush in or out of office, then I’m willing to talk about what Trump did.

    Anything less is the worst kind of hypocrisy that should be met with a worse eternal fate than the burning Bushes.

  • Vince

    For pete’s sake, we don’t vote for a god or a messiah.

    The alternative was so much worse.

  • Dicksie Garrett

    Fully agree. Just a reminder on history might be good, too. Kennedy was known for his marital infidelity even in a time when it was less accepted, yet Democrats revere him. Johnson, too, was unfaithful. Regan, great man that he was, had been divorced and remarried which was not so common then and which many Christians at least USED to oppose, and his wife consulted horoscopes. Bush’s wife, Laura, was a proponent(!) of abortion. Bill Clinton was involved in several sex scandals…and lies… WHILE he was a sitting president and yet is held up by the left as a great man. Donald Trump obviously has his faults and has had a less than stellar moral past, but that ‘appears’ to be in the PAST and certainly does not reach to any greater level than many past presidents who committed their sins not just prior to but also during their presidencies.

  • John Doe

    The writer could have included Jesus Christ’s response as well as Franklin Grahams.
    “Let him who has no sin cast the first stone”.
    King David made multiple mistakes that included infidelity and murder, yet the Lord referred to him as a man after his own heart. That tells me there are deeper things to be considered than the obvious mistakes SINS we all commit.
    Thankfully for me and for you if you believe that Jesus Christ is LORD

  • Elizabeth Litts

    I read these comments and I am very discusted. Have none of you read Church history-or the Word??? God has chosen the foolish things to confound the wise. Have we all become so wise all the sudden that we think we can tell God who to save and not to. Do we dare to tell God that we know better than he does as far as someone’s realtionship with Him?? I think we better watch our step when we start deciding who ‘deserves’ what. We all diserve Hell and death, but we are all saved by the grace and the Blood of the Lamb.

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